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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.05 15:19:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Caelum Dominus on 05/07/2009 15:21:13
Originally by: Exlegion to start off they could use an increase to around 30 to 60 seconds in scan time with max skills.
Yeah, let's continue to nerf the **** out of PvP because you don't like it. On a more helpful note, there's no need to scan for probes in the first place. Just stay aligned and warp whenever someone decloaks. It's that easy.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.05 16:03:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Caelum Dominus on 05/07/2009 16:04:39
Originally by: Tres Farmer
1) less probability to survive in hostile environment = less targets
This is the wrong way to go about introducing people to low-sec. It should be done by increasing the reward, not lowering the risk.
Originally by: Tres Farmer
2) you cant stay aligned all the time (try hacking a can for instance in a BC/BS aligned to the next planet, LOL)
You're not supposed to be 100% safe.
Originally by: Tres Farmer
3) less targets = more PvP'er whine on the forums about scarceness of targets (as if it isn't already as bad as it could be, but looks like you clueless knucklehead really want more of it)
See #1.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.05 16:15:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Caelum Dominus on 05/07/2009 16:15:45
Originally by: Exlegion Caelum Dominus,
You don't find that having to spam the scan button every 5 seconds in order to find out if you're being probed unrealistic? Try running a mission while spamming a button every 5 seconds to see how long it takes you to go insane.
I find it completely ridiculous, but seeing that it makes you 110% safe (something that goes against the very essence of EVE) I think it's reasonable.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.05 16:24:00 -
[4]
Originally by: KaarBaak
In a lot of movies/TV shows, ships are alerted by their on-board sensors (module?) that they are being scanned.
Nothing detailed, just an alert that your ship has been hit by a probe scan.
Hey, I have a better idea; why don't we just have the pilot probing announce "I AM A PIRATE AND I AM GOING TO KILL YOU, AND NOW I KNOW WHERE YOU ARE" in local automatically?
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.05 18:49:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Caelum Dominus on 05/07/2009 18:49:59
Originally by: Orivanna There are some of you who are SUPPORTING spamming a button EVERY 3 SECONDS?
You don't understand. You are not meant to press the button every 3 seconds, because you are not meant to be entirely safe in EVE.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.05 18:54:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Exlegion
And how is a cloaked cov ops probing for mission runners not 100% safe?
I trust you are joking. The risk obviously lies in the encounter that ensues when the probing completes...
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.05 18:57:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Blane Xero Spamming the button does not make you 100% safe. You forget; People don't use permarun settups in lowsec. They use agile settups (Or should be). They have to dock, and warp from gates/stations. They have abandon missions or wait out hours at a time as soon as some pirates get a bookmark to the mission site.
If you catching targets relies 100% on the fast-scan technique, then you sir are a truly abysmal PvPer. You're almost as bad as you are trying to make lowsec explorers/missioners who actually use the scanning function look.
I don't. In fact, I don't even tend to probe mission runners at all. I am merely an advocate of promoting PvP, non-consentual or otherwise. I propose the risk stays, but the reward is increased.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.05 19:04:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Caelum Dominus on 05/07/2009 19:05:01
Originally by: Blane Xero Jet cans - Prevents cloaking, but does not decloak. (though, there is a vague doubt in my mind that says this was changed with the cloaked ships decloaking cloaked ships, but i believe not) Oh and also, not all ships exit an accel gate in the same 2km sphere, its more like 7-10km.
Jet cans decloak, as do cloaked ships. Either way, this is besides the point; again, I am sure you realize that the risk in probing down mission runners lies in the encounter that ensues once it completes.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.06 07:09:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Exlegion Sorted,
You honestly expect someone to smash the scan button every 5 seconds for 30 minutes, 60 minutes, or however long the mission is just to mission in low sec? Are you being sarcastic or are you serious? Seriously, have you ever attempted in running a mission in low sec at all?
You just don't get it, do you. You're not supposed to be 100% safe in EVE, and that's why scanning for probes every 5 seconds is physically impossible. It's working as intended.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.06 09:41:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Banana Torres If by becoming safer more people enter low sec, then there are more targets and so more PvP.
...
Okay, let me spell it out for you; low-sec becoming an (even) safer place isn't going to contribute to PvP. Having more targets is all fine and dandy, but if you can never get to those targets it's a moot point.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.06 10:30:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Caelum Dominus on 06/07/2009 10:32:18
Originally by: Sheriff Jones
Originally by: Sheriff Jones
Aye this logic does baffle me somewhat
100 people passing through lowsec - 10% chance of a pvp encounter = 10 fights 1000 people passing through loswec - 1% chance of a pvp encounter = 10 fights
Net result
10 fights
Don't the chances of a PVP encounter go UP and not down with more people?
You, sir, are an idiot.
Quote: It is a balance thing and, like all such issues in Eve, I leave it to the devs to decide were the want to set the balance.
I repeat myself on this point, but I propose the balance is set by increasing the reward, not lowering the risk.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.06 10:49:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Banana Torres
Would it be possible to increase the reward in low sec enough so that it does not become greater than the rewards from 0.0?
Sure.
Originally by: Banana Torres Also, dont use the ad hominem argument it is called a logical fallacy for a reason.
I don't follow. "You, sir, are an idiot" seems an appropriate response to someone who either fails to understand a very simple point or even read it altogether.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.06 10:58:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Caelum Dominus on 06/07/2009 11:02:08 Edited by: Caelum Dominus on 06/07/2009 11:00:28
Originally by: Banana Torres
Originally by: Caelum Dominus
I don't follow. "You, sir, are an idiot" seems an appropriate response to someone who either fails to understand a very simple point or even read it altogether.
Maybe in the children's playground. Silence is my usual response. And with that I leave this thread.
Welcome to the internet. ;)
Originally by: Banana Torres Sure is a simple answer, but have you thought about what it means?
It's not just a bonus to those who go there every now and then, but also a bonus for the people living there 24/7.
More rewards, more ships, bigger and faster and suddenly, they can handle the extra people who come after the bigger reward and we're at the same point again.
I'm not sure I understand. I'm arguing that increasing the reward for doing missions, ratting or whathaveyou in low-sec would generate an incentive to come here. As it is, doing missions in high-sec is vastly superior income to nearly anything low-sec can offer unless you have adequate protection and/or wits, and I think that should be changed. This has to do with the balance of income in a "high-sec vs low-sec" scenario, not bigger and faster ships or whatever it is you're trying to convey. :)
If I am missing your point, please elaborate.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.06 11:18:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Caelum Dominus on 06/07/2009 11:21:47 Edited by: Caelum Dominus on 06/07/2009 11:21:05
Quote: The point i tried to make is that if you simply increase the reward in lowsec, it increases the income of the "bad people" there too, giving them better equipment to deal with the people who come there.
So in that way, decreasing risk is the better option as it only effects the people going there without boosting the "bad people". But i know, it's a bit off the point.
This is a fair point, but I still maintain that increasing the reward is the way to go. The risk is already low and should stay.
Originally by: Sheriff Jones What i suggest is some form of "risk vs reward" slider option, like they had in anarchy online. More risk, lower sec, more reward.
This already exists, albeit in a less obvious manner. Taking a battleship to do missions in low-sec is on the high end of the slider you describe, whereas killing belt NPCs in a frigate is on the low-end. ;)
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.06 14:31:00 -
[15]
I approve of the above rant.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.06 15:35:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Le Skunk
Originally by: Exlegion
I can no longer take a chance at continuing a mission when even just one neutral sits in my system because my onboard scanner has the greater probability of failing me.
To be fair if a probably afk neutral pilot in system is enough to keep someone docked, they dont belong in any pvp environment, be it lowsec or 0.0. I think we can ALL agree this.
The old probing system was easier to scan down ships. CCP altered it, and now we are left with a situation where pvpers have to fiddle around moving probes in formation around the map, and bears have to hit scan more often.
Both parties lose out, but CCP get some nice graphical orbs crosshatch shennagans to show people. good luck if you decide to move to 0.0.
Now, now... I love the new probing system for many reasons. It's faster (if you know your way around it) and you can insta-probe anyone in a safespot 300-400km off gates.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.06 22:21:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Exlegion Come on, man. Why can't you see that smashing a button and going through results every 5 seconds for 45 minutes is way over the top!?
To those applauding this change, how would you feel if all of a sudden to catch anything you have to spam a button 540 times and go through the displayed results 540 times every 45 minutes just to guarantee you a fight? And considering that you wouldn't be micro-managing your ship against NPC's this scenario would still be easier than having to do all of the above and mission in low sec.
This isn't laziness from our part, folks. This is insanity. And I'm willing to bet it's an oversight from CCP's part.
I could repeat what I said about you never being meant to be 100% safe, but you would no doubt ignore it as before. I will leave you to your ignorance.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.07 12:08:00 -
[18]
You. Are. Not. Supposed. To. Be. Safe. In. Low-sec.
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Caelum Dominus
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.07.07 13:15:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Caelum Dominus on 07/07/2009 13:17:51
Originally by: Forge Lag
I do not often mission in low in large part because I refuse to play crappy games and EvE luckily lets me avoid its sucky parts. My gaming standards are higher than "push button every five seconds". For the pirates that seems to be a pinnacle of gaming skills.
What do you mean "my gaming standards are higher than pushing a button every five seconds"? Are you referring to killing NPCs in high-sec, sir?
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